Decal Techniques...

[Deleted]

Hi everyone,
Many very experienced and talented people here.
I would like to pick some brains if possible regarding the application of decals...

Two main questions:

1) After applying a decal, what can be done to ensure its longevity?  Top coat?
   ( I have several builds that have decals that are dried up and peeling off now after time on the shelf. )

2) How does one soften a decal enough to get it to wrap around corners and into grooves?
    Like the driver's helmet decals. They have always been so difficult for me.


I'd really appreciate your feedback with as much detail as feel is necessary.

Thanks,

Matsu

[kip]

1. I coat the decal--and the rest of the model--with Future, the floor coating. You can also put down a layer of Future as a surface to apply the decal to. Its provides a nice smooth surface and eliminates most "silvering". Any clear coat should also work.

2. I like Micro-Sol. You can use it when laying down the decal and--after the decal dries--if there is a spot that did not cling tight, you can reapply the Micro-Sol and blot it down. Most of the time I just apply the decal and see what happens when it dries and then apply the Micro-Sol where needed.

kip

[gwstexas]

I agree with Kip. A good clear coat will protect your decals from cracking or peeling. A word of caution: always test your clear coat on an unused portion of the decals sheet to make sure the clear coat won't destroy the decals. I've never heard of Future or any other acrylic clear damaging the decals, but always be sure to check lacquers and urethanes.
Another tip: I've found cosmetic sponges to be very good for smoothing and conforming decals. You can get them in large bags at Wal-Mart or any drug store or beauty supply.
Good luck decaling your models,
Gary

[GrandPrecision]

Use microsol and a hair-dryer while applying decals to ensure there are no air bubbles under the decal. If you do this correctly, you will be able to clear without any wrinkle or bubbles while applying a wet coat immediately.

[Aurora]

Good advice here. I'd concur with the advice to test your clear coat. And I would add that you should also test any decal setting solution and decals solvent solution.

There are so many different brands of product - decals (including easy DIY laser printed decals), ink, paper, carrier film, paint, clear coat, setters, and solvents - that testing each product on a scrap piece first is a prudent precaution.

[Deleted]

Thanks for all the great feedback guys. (sorry to have been away)

A couple of things regarding your suggestions:

With the MicroSol, is that intended for the initially soaking a decal rather than water? ...or just brush application after placement.

Regarding Future: Apparently Pledge purchased that company and the original Future is no longer available.
Does anyone know if the new "Pledge Future" is any good for this technique?

Appreciate the comments everyone...

Matsu

[Aurora]

I have only applied MicroSol to decals after placement, and I believe that is the intended use. I do not think that soaking the decal in MicroSol is advisable, but I have never tested the idea. Doing so may dissolve the decal on the backing paper and render the decal unusable.

For some detailed info on Future, check this out:
www.swannysmodels.com/TheCompleteFuture.html

[indycals]

I know some people swear by future. I have not been impressed with it the few times I've used it.

[GrandPrecision]

Sept 2, 2015 1:17:24 GMT -5 Aurora said:

I have only applied MicroSol to decals after placement, and I believe that is the intended use. I do not think that soaking the decal in MicroSol is advisable, but I have never tested the idea. Doing so may dissolve the decal on the backing paper and render the decal unusable.

For some detailed info on Future, check this out:
www.swannysmodels.com/TheCompleteFuture.html

Agreed, Soak in water, apply on the car. Then try to get as much air out underneath with a tissue, then with brushing Micro-Sol on the area and using a hair dryer. (Thats my method)

Used Future previously, but after doing the above method, I simply clear the entire car with a rattle can clear.

[harveythedog2]

The bad thing about Future is that you can never clean your model again afterwards. Future is water souluable. (spl?) In other words it breaks down with any water based cleaner. It actually starts rubbing away. You also cannot wax your model again. For me, a good clear top coat is the only permanant way to go. If you do not use an airbrush, Testors clear laquer is great and compatible with most all paints. *Always test it first though so you don't ruin all your work!"

[spyder]

There are many ways to skin a cat. Each of us develop our own favorite processes that after some repetition, become our own. With the exception of the Rat Rod guys and military modelers, most of us are creating gloss finishes. If you have a good gloss finish you should be able to decal right over it without any "silvering". If you have some "orange peel", polish it out and then decal. No need for an additional clear coat. I have, for several years, used just one decal solvent, Gunze's Mr. Mark Softer. I only brush it on to the decal after I have aligned it. I may go back and re- brush it on if the decal shows some resistance to settling in. If all is well, let the decals and solvents dry, wash with a water soaked brush or Q-Tip and pat dry with a Kleenex.

Clear over coats: I too am not a Future , or whatever they call it now, proponent. In the past, when Floquil Chrystal Kote and Diosol were still in their original non PC formula, I had great success with this as my "go to" final finish. Now I use DuPont Chroma-Clear two part automotive clear. It goes through the airbrush with no reducers required. I am getting a bit concerned about shelf life. The curing seems to take longer the older my cans are. Friends are having great success with rattle can Testors "Wet Look" and Tamiya clears. But, aside from a/c canopies, I steer away from Furure.

Now, as I am not the best painter, my base color coats and clear coats are never flawless. So I resort to the Micro Mesh polishing system to level everything out and give a 1-1 sheen to the final finish. I sand out the base color coat up to the 4000 or 6000 cloth in order to give a really smooth surface for the decals and the clear coat and still have enough "tooth" to grab the clear coat. This leaves a clear coat that usually doesn't need much effort to level. After using the Micro Mesh System on the clear I do a final polish with Tamiya polishing compounds. If you are putting a really dark solid color on, especially black, an automotive anti-haze, anti-swirl compound will kill the grayish, cloudy appearance.

One final note - Matt Wells of Scale Motorsport has just started to market a new decal solvent no doubt inspired by the challenge of wrapping all those carbon fiber decals around Enzos and Murcielagos. I haven't tried it yet, but will have some soon and try to give a review of it. Hope this helps find another way to skin a cat. Model on, dudes. spyder

[clm1545]

Some great advice here. I used MicroSol/Microset for years with good results. Michael, and Calvin liked the Solvaset, so I tried it, and like it better than the other. I brush some setting agent on the body, touch the decal to a paper towel to get rid of most of the water, then slide it to the surface.
I used Future for years and was generally pleased with it, but although it is super simple to use, it has some drawbacks.
It is not a high gloss, most racecars don't have a super shine, so that might not be a problem.
It is not a real hard finish, so dust will stick to it, and as mentioned, you can't clean it with water.
If you don't keep your models in a dust free case, I would not use it.
It can yellow over time, heat, and humidity seem to cause this. Keep it out of the sunlight.
Tamiya clear works well, but it's very hot, and if applied too heavy can cause the paint to bleed. I tend to apply paint too heavy, so that's a real problem.
The Testors "Wet Look Clear" lacquer works the best, for me. I use Krylon, and Tamiya paint, and have not had any problem with it. Tom, and Ed, along with Jim Stephens, have done some of the most stunning paint work I have ever seen, but they all polish the paint work on their builds. I'm too lazy for that, and I don't like to use an airbrush. Be aware that whatever system works for you the best, sooner or later, it will bite you in the butt. That's just the way it works.

[indycals]

The best solvent depends on the decal - sort of trial and error. With the decals I make, Microsol and Microset don't seem to react very well (i.e., they seem somewhat ineffective) Solvaset is very strong and can destroy decals if you aren't careful - my decals handle it better than others. For the most part my decals generally don't need setting solution except for very tricky areas, but I've found that if you want to clear coat, I recommend hitting them with solvaset to melt them to the paint to minimize the chance of wrinkling under clear coat.

[Deleted]

Terrific content everyone...

Michael, I think you are right in that it depends on the decal. I've tried MicroSol on the decals furnished with the Revell Monogram Reynard kits and found it to be ineffective.
I noticed that your (Michael's Indycals) are on a finer film than the Revell Monogram decals.

I will try Microset and Solvaset on the Revell Monogram decals to see if they are any more effective.

Thanks everyone! ; )

[smbrm]

As far a I know, Microsol, microset, & solvaset are all ammonia based decal solvents. The distinctive odour is related to the ammonia and its concentration. Solvaset appears to be the most aggressive. All can be diluted with water to stop or mute the activity. Ammonia is a common household cleaner, so I am not sure that future would stand up to its application since diluted ammonia is often used to strip floors of wax or other temporary coatings in addition to floor dirt. I agree with those who recommend testing before blind use. I start with the least aggressive first and move up as needed. But even Solvaset will not soften some decals.

Hot water and/or the hair dryer can be helpful. I also use flat sable brushes for positioning, water and solvent application, as well as squeegying out water. Ensuring you don't wash off the decal glue is also important.

I have coated(brush on) some Alps decals with future, but never a whole car. I have seen models where future was used, including some where the whole model including tyres was hosed with future. Really shiny, but not a scale shine.

Race car graphics evolved over the years from being painted on by sign painters through vinyl stickers to now, full body wraps. However in reality, it has been my observation that clear coating a car to entrap any decals on professional racing cars seem more rare than common.

I don't clear coat decals at all(exception noted above). Yes I have had some models where decals have flaked off, others not. I have often wondered where decals have degraded whether the decal application technique and inappropriate use of the decal solvents contributed to the durability?

So, there you have another 2cents on the topic, soon you'll be rich enough to claim a dollar!!

Cheers

Stephen