Penske PC-18

[russd]

Here are a few pixs of the Penske-PC18 convserion I'm working on. The photography isn't the greatest but at least I've figured out how to post images (I think).





Russ

[indy]

COOL!!! ;D

Jordan

[macsparty]

I agree. Excellent!

[russd]

Some progress. Changed my mind, instead of the Sullivan (Miller) car I went for the Mears (Pennzoil) PC18. Color is Tamiya Yellow TS34, Decals are Indycals and a few Speedline (M@r1b0r0).

[2lapsdown]

Awesome!!

[stonecold44]

Someone needs to write a manual on how to do a conversion. I'm willing to bet that buying kits gets a bit pricey after awhile.
By the way Russ, it looks awesome.

[indy]

Holy smokes that it AWESOME!!! ;D Excellent choice in drivers if I do say so myself!!

Jordan

[Deleted]

Russ,

Looks great!!!!!! Keep us posted on the progress!

Best to you

Russ

[indy]

So, are those decals a mix of the '86 and the '88 Pennzoil cars? Just making sure there isn't another set of decals that I don't have ;D lol

Jordan

[russd]

Jun 11, 2008 14:42:49 GMT -5 indy said:

So, are those decals a mix of the '86 and the '88 Pennzoil cars? Just making sure there isn't another set of decals that I don't have ;D lol

Jordan

Jordan,

Keen eye! The #4's are from the 86 Pennzoil March (Indycals), "Holset Turbo" are from 88 Hertz PC17 (Indycals), 'M@r1b0r0' are from the Speedline Tobacco set, and the rest are from the 88 Pennzoil Penske. I think, between the two of us, we probably have every possible Indy decal sheet. I don't have many decals for cars earlier than 1970, but I do have almost every thing available for cars from 1970 up to the current.

The reason I switched from the Miller car of Sullivan to the Pennzoil car is that I really couldn't replicate the the Miller cars markings. Most of the large stuff would have worked, but the smaller sponsors (like) BOSCH are black on white lettering. As far as I know, There is nothing like that available. To bad, because I would have really liked to do that Gold and White paint job (especially the Gold "speed" wheel covers used at Indy).

One thing I would like to mention to the group is the Red color on the Indycal decals. When you look at the decals as they come they are actually a maroon color (not red). Don't worry about this, they are printed semi-transparent and the color will turn a bright red as soon as they are laid over a yellow background. Quite ingenious.

[macsparty]

[quote author=russd board=cart thread=161 post=1228 time=1213227314
One thing I would like to mention to the group is the Red color on the Indycal decals. When you look at the decals as they come they are actually a maroon color (not red). Don't worry about this, they are printed semi-transparent and the color will turn a bright red as soon as they are laid over a yellow background. Quite ingenious.

[/quote]

Hey, that is great to know! I have a set, and I've been wondering about that for some time and haven't been brave enough to try it. I'm glad you mentioned that.

[stonecold44]

Jun 11, 2008 18:35:14 GMT -5 russd said:

Jun 11, 2008 14:42:49 GMT -5 indy said:

So, are those decals a mix of the '86 and the '88 Pennzoil cars? Just making sure there isn't another set of decals that I don't have ;D lol

Jordan

The reason I switched from the Miller car of Sullivan to the Pennzoil car is that I really couldn't replicate the the Miller cars markings. Most of the large stuff would have worked, but the smaller sponsors (like) BOSCH are black on white lettering. As far as I know, There is nothing like that available. To bad, because I would have really liked to do that Gold and White paint job (especially the Gold "speed" wheel covers used at Indy).

I did the Miller PC-17 with number 1 for the car used in 1989, not knowing back then that the chassis were alot different. Don't know if you have that decal sheet but I have a few. Just drop me a line and I'll send it to you.
Interestingly, after looking at the line-up sheet from the '89 race, it looks like Sullivan qualified a white PC-18 with Miller markings. I'd assume it was his back-up car since he wrecked his primary and broke his wrist in the process. I should do that one just because it looked so generic for a Penske car.

[russd]

Quote
I did the Miller PC-17 with number 1 for the car used in 1989, not knowing back then that the chassis were alot different. Don't know if you have that decal sheet but I have a few. Just drop me a line and I'll send it to you.

Reply
Thanks for the offer... Unfortunately, The small sponsor decals that come with the PC-17 Miller kit are all red. On the 89 car the markings are nearly the same but these sponsor markings were changed to black letters with a white outline. They probably figured that this would show up better than all red letters on a gold background.
The #1 marking is valid for the PC-17. I believe that Sullivan drove the rest of the CART season with the #1 marking on his PC-17 during 1988.



Quote
Interestingly, after looking at the line-up sheet from the '89 race, it looks like Sullivan qualified a white PC-18 with Miller markings. I'd assume it was his back-up car since he wrecked his primary and broke his wrist in the process. I should do that one just because it looked so generic for a Penske car.

Reply
On the inside of the back cover of the 1989 Carl Hungness Indy 500 Yearbook, there is a full page picture of Sullivan's post qualifying picture in this car ("refrigerator" white PC-18).

[indy]

Jun 11, 2008 18:53:34 GMT -5 macsparty said:

[quote author=russd board=cart thread=161 post=1228 time=1213227314
One thing I would like to mention to the group is the Red color on the Indycal decals. When you look at the decals as they come they are actually a maroon color (not red). Don't worry about this, they are printed semi-transparent and the color will turn a bright red as soon as they are laid over a yellow background. Quite ingenious.

Hey, that is great to know! I have a set, and I've been wondering about that for some time and haven't been brave enough to try it. I'm glad you mentioned that.[/quote]

That's GREAT news. No offense to Mike @ Indycals but I'd been pretty disappointed when I saw how dark the red markings were. Guess he's a lot smarter than me about ALPS decals ;D

BTW, one thing I noticed about the PC-17 is when you look at pics of the 500's start the pinstriped Penskes (Mears and Unser Sr) look so tall and narrow while Sully's car looks more low and wide due to the differing paint scheme... just thought it was interesting! But I'm an Indy nerd like that - lol ;D

Jordan

[indy]

NOTE: To avoid hijacking another thread, I am replying to something not said here.

IIRC the PC-17 dash from your glue bomb is not accurate for the PC-18. I believe the PC-18 was one of, if no the first Indycar to have an electronic dashboard. The PC sim "Indianapolis 500: The Simulation" was based off of the '89 race and the Penske was the only car in it with a digital dash.

I'm sure the 1989 Hungness book has good references but I don't have it but I'll check what I have to see if I can verify dash config if you want. No harm in putting the PC-17 dash in if you wanted to do it but I wanted to mention this

Jordan

[russd]

Jun 12, 2008 12:35:24 GMT -5 indy said:

NOTE: To avoid hijacking another thread, I am replying to something not said here.

IIRC the PC-17 dash from your glue bomb is not accurate for the PC-18. I believe the PC-18 was one of, if no the first Indycar to have an electronic dashboard. The PC sim "Indianapolis 500: The Simulation" was based off of the '89 race and the Penske was the only car in it with a digital dash.

I'm sure the 1989 Hungness book has good references but I don't have it but I'll check what I have to see if I can verify dash config if you want. No harm in putting the PC-17 dash in if you wanted to do it but I wanted to mention this

Jordan

Thanks, I probably would have not noticed the dash.

Anyone out there know anything about the pneumatic jacking system on the Indy cars? I'm working on the under tray for the PC-18 (a work of fiction in this case) and I want to attempt to get it semi-believable. I think there are supposed to be two holes in the under tray where the front jacks come down out of the car. I think these things are located near the front on most cars (right behind the dash bulkhead?). At the back there is 1 jack that comes out near the wing support. I have absolutely no information about the under tray on this car (or for that matter, any other car). I'm willing to take a poll to see where you guys think these things are actually located.

The Hungness books are the best references I've found. They show up on Ebay from time to time. I've been able to score copies of most of the 80's and 90's. However, there are few pictures of the cockpits of the cars (never are), so any info about the internals is welcome. I've already notice a half a dozen errors in what I've done already, I'll just have to get them right the next time I build one of these.

[indy]

Here's the dash and I have a pic of Arie's '90 dash which is nothing like it. This was definitely a first model that they likely replaced for the next year.



As far as jackstands, I believe the typical arrangement today is one at the very back by the gearbox and then two on either side of the driver's tub back in the sidepods. Like this:





But back in the day it wasn't so standardized.... as you can see from these pics below....



www.flickr.com/photos/cobby17/355432695/

I couldn't find anything concrete about the PC18 but I don't have the 1989 Indy 500 Yearbook. Hope these help!

Jordan

[russd]

Jordan,
Hey, thanks for the reference photos! Especially the one of the cockpit and dash. The jackstand pictures verify a couple of things. First of all, there were 3 jacks (I never really notice this before) and secondly, the relative position of the front set.
Russ

[Larryc39]

Was there an article about the conversion in Scale Auto Mag? Are the two chassis significantly different?

[indy]

When comparing the PC-17 and PC-18 from Tameo: Overall dimensions they are fairly similar but there are several differences in the cockpit opening, leading edge of the radiator openings, and the rear bodywork.

Jordan