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Post by stuboyle on Sept 30, 2009 16:29:20 GMT -5
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Post by stuboyle on Sept 30, 2009 16:32:54 GMT -5
What? Expletive deleted! Since when is "Market watch" (one word) and expletive! lol!
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Post by stuboyle on Sept 30, 2009 16:34:37 GMT -5
What? Expletive deleted! Since when is "Market watch" (one word) and expletive! lol! I humbly apologize and fall on the mercy of the the court. ;D |
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Post by indy on Sept 30, 2009 17:07:50 GMT -5
Well, the language filter isn't perfect but it is a nice way to not have to monitor the board 24/7. I think you can figure out what it was trying to block - I've had it happen to me here before on an innocent post. I have looked over the controls and it isn't intrusive 99.9% of the time so I leave it. You might try www.tinyurl.com or another service like that when you run into this again ;D Jordan |
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Post by stuboyle on Sept 30, 2009 17:17:11 GMT -5
Actually Jordon, I've never used the word in question. I don't even know what it means!
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Post by indy on Sept 30, 2009 18:48:49 GMT -5
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Post by Calvin on Sept 30, 2009 19:09:01 GMT -5
You got to feel sorry for the people working at Saturn Dealers with an uncertain future
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2009 11:44:04 GMT -5
GM=brain dead. Take your best product line with your overall best performing vehicles and throw it in the trash. I have no sympathy at all for GM.
Of course I'm trying to figure out why Penske didn't just buy the manufacturing facilities rather than try to farm it out to someone else. Now here he is with all of his dealerships just hung out to dry. Real swift.
Saturn should be saved at all costs. They are innovative and have reliable, fuel efficient vehicles at a good price. The more you look at this thing, the more it reminds you of the Tucker. The vehicle is too good and God forbid GM have a spin-off actually competing against them. Only 13,000 more jobs down the toilet.
If the government should ever take a stake in anything, it should be Saturn.
O.K. I'm done venting now. I find this whole very infuriating especially in light of the fact that I own a Saturn and have been very pleased with the vehicle.
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Post by indy on Oct 1, 2009 13:44:52 GMT -5
Saturn is still a GM property so the dealerships are their liabilities. All of Penske's current dealerships should still be fine.
It would be interesting if Penske bought a car manufacturer as I'd have to wrestle my wife's Civic away from her - lol - which we found out after we bought it that the dealer was part of the Penske network of dealerships.
Jordan
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Post by professor on Oct 1, 2009 13:57:24 GMT -5
must not have made fiscal sense, Penske is not stupid.
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Post by indycals on Oct 1, 2009 15:18:46 GMT -5
must not have made fiscal sense, Penske is not stupid. He couldn't find anyone to manufacture them. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 2, 2009 11:53:08 GMT -5
Really dumb question - could Penske actually swing a deal to buy the production facilities from GM and manufacture them on his own? Or was his original idea to farm out the manufacturing? I'm still trying to figure out just exactly how he proposed to do this.
Just curious.
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Post by indycals on Oct 2, 2009 12:23:32 GMT -5
He was going to farm out the manufacturing.
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Post by indy on Oct 2, 2009 12:24:09 GMT -5
The stated plan was have GM continue production for two years and then have some current auto manufacturer take over production at the end of GM's tenure. Penske's team had a deal with an unknown company in the works but the unknown company's board of directors killed the plan. Penske's guys had to have crunched the numbers for starting their own plant or taking over a decommissioned plant but it looks like they couldn't make the numbers work  IDK but the local Saturn dealership has been touting the deal so I'm sure they aren't happy about any of this.... I'd like to have seen GM be willing to spend more money to make the Penske deal happen. Right now, Saturn and their dealer network is a liability to GM - a huge one at that so it seems like anything short of the cost of that liability would be a better solution. Why not put another billion or so into helping the Penske deal? Jordan |
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Post by stuboyle on Oct 2, 2009 12:51:11 GMT -5
Okay, now here is a real conspiracy. What if it was all a ruse to begin with to prop-up Saturn sales?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 2, 2009 13:49:37 GMT -5
From 1994 to 1999, I was fortunate enough to work for the Saturn Automotive Company in Marketing, Sales and Advertising. At first, Saturn was a quirky little car and then they got better and more comfortable to drive. In 1996 Saturn was giving Honda and Toyota a run for the money in America. They were selling really well......Then the morons at GM saw the "little car that could" was doing well and want back in, which the original contract allowed.
I sadly remember the day in 1999, when the powers that be from GM had a satellite video conference with some marketing squirt named Kennedy, to announce the "new" larger car Saturn was going to build at the Wilmington, Delaware plant by former GM workers.....The new car would have nothing that made the current Saturn so special..(Like the steel timing chain or the dent resistant side panels), the strong selling points of the Saturn. The writing was on the wall and I left the company shortly after and I never regretted the move...(Some of my former co-workers have cussed me for not telling them that I was going to and why.) Saturn went down hill with the larger car and it had 8, now mind you Saturn had one recall at first and handled it beautifully, the new abomination on wheels had 8 "campaigns" they called them, the rest of the world called them recalls due to poor workmanship and Saturn has never recovered.
I had at one time owned three different model Saturn's. It was a good little car, safe and durable...Jokes were at one time being made about Saturn that folks used to make about the old Dodge Darts of the 1960's....After the holocaust, you'd see 10 foot tall cockroaches driving them. Saturn is a perfect example of a good thing screwed up by poor thinking.....GM handled this line poorly and then F***ed it up.
Just my two cents and the hell with GM!
Russ
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Post by SWT500 on Oct 2, 2009 13:57:53 GMT -5
I appreciated your post and I share your sentiments, not only about GM but the so-called "Big Three". What you didn't mention is that Saturn , in the beginning, didn't want anyone to know GM was the parent company. Based on your experience, a wise decision. Your comments reminded me of today's laughable Saturn commercials where the pitchman says, "We been doing right by people since day 1"!
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Post by indy on Oct 2, 2009 14:39:09 GMT -5
One of my good friends bought a Saturn back when they first hit the market (around '91) - it was a teal SC2 (I think) - the sporty coupe with a couple of upgraded styling cues. So, now, what does he drive? That same teal '91 SC2 - a great car that still looks and runs really well ;D That is how I will pleasantly remember Saturn
Jordan
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Post by professor on Oct 2, 2009 15:19:53 GMT -5
Maybe GM's next new line will be called Uranus!!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 2, 2009 16:17:41 GMT -5
Jordan,
I worked closely with a Saturn Dealership in Monrovia, California and a grumpy old curmudgeon named Tom.....and Salesman bought a dark blue SL2 in 1993........by January of 1999, he had put 500,000 miles driving up and down the coast of California making sales calls. He was even considered for a Commercial but after he told a Nun who was thinking of buying one, "You'd be a God**** fool if you didn't!", that deal was dropped. Tom O......Uranus, CLASSIC! ;D
The early Saturn's were built to last a lifetime.....the big ones were a typical GM abomination, sad to say....As Will Rogers would say, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it."
Oh, The Nun, Sister Barbara bought the Saturn....her comment was when asked why?......."I didn't want to be a God**** fool, would you?" She still drives it too, a Silver SC2.
Best to you
Russ
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2009 0:02:10 GMT -5
My little Saturn is an '04 Ion which I bought from my neighbor last year. The guy had no problems with it, he was just thinning out his vehicles. This thing has consistently performed in the 30-35 mpg range and has very good pickup. The engine compartment is wide open for easy maintenance unlike GM's other engineering scams where you have to pay $1000 to change a $30 water pump, etc.
As I was preaching before, this division deserves to live as a stand-alone company to offer some real competition and innovation in design. Their designs really do stand apart from the other GM "cookie cutter" stuff. Studebaker filled this type of role in ancient automotive history.
I really feel for the people at Saturn who felt they had dodged a bullet only to have had a bomb dropped on them. I say give Saturn some bailout loot to give them a new lease on life.
Okay, enough of my Saturn cheerleading for now.
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Post by stuboyle on Oct 4, 2009 4:12:15 GMT -5
I owned a 93 Saturn SL2. If I recall, it lasted us until about 2003. We got 144,000 miles out of it until it just became too unrealiable. Overall, it was about as good as other American cars I've owned. Now I got 2 Toyota Corollas and hoping to get them well over 200,000 out of them, but we shall see.
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