My Favorite Indy Car

[kyledehart5]

That is an awesome touch of detail.

[INDY22IAM]

This is going to be one of the most detialed 1/25th scale builds out there. I hate how slow it is going but I understand. I can not wait to see what is next on the agenda. Very impressive build. Keep up the great work.

[pje]

Housed right inside of the engine bulkhead is the oil tank. In his book, How To Build a Car, Adrian Newy spends a couple of pages describing the problems they were having with the oil tank at Indianapolis. They kept having oil pressure dropouts, typically between turns 1 and 2. Newy describes having dinner with Mario Illen, the first part of Illmore engines, and redesigning the tank. The next morning he would have a new drawing for the mechanics to weld in some different baffles and give it another go. This went on for the entire week of practice before they finally got it worked out on the first day of qualifying.





To make sure there was flow, they fired up the engine, and Newy with the oil cap off, shined a flashlight into the tank so he could see it was operating properly. It was! And then the cap of his ball point pen fell into the tank! They didn’t have time to pull the tank and remove the cap, so they all said a prayer and sent Mario out. As history shows, Mario had not problems that day. Now if anyone has a 1/25th scale ball point pen cap and wants to contribute to my build, I’d be happy to include it.

Paul Erlendson

[Calvin]

Of all things to fall in the tank lol.

Sure I'll cast one out of resin. Lol 😉

[kyledehart5]

Sept 5, 2023 20:41:27 GMT -5 pje said:

Housed right inside of the engine bulkhead is the oil tank. In his book, How To Build a Car, Adrian Newy spends a couple of pages describing the problems they were having with the oil tank at Indianapolis. They kept having oil pressure dropouts, typically between turns 1 and 2. Newy describes having dinner with Mario Illen, the first part of Illmore engines, and redesigning the tank. The next morning he would have a new drawing for the mechanics to weld in some different baffles and give it another go. This went on for the entire week of practice before they finally got it worked out on the first day of qualifying.





To make sure there was flow, they fired up the engine, and Newy with the oil cap off, shined a flashlight into the tank so he could see it was operating properly. It was! And then the cap of his ball point pen fell into the tank! They didn’t have time to pull the tank and remove the cap, so they all said a prayer and sent Mario out. As history shows, Mario had not problems that day. Now if anyone has a 1/25th scale ball point pen cap and wants to contribute to my build, I’d be happy to include it.

Paul Erlendson

Excellent history lesson. Loving this.

[pje]

I’ve not spent much time on the bench of late, but in the little time that I have, I’ve been concentrating on the cockpit area. Nothing to show of that yet.
So, to keep the thread going, here are a couple of photos I had taken quite a while ago. Forgive their poor quality.
Early on I worked on the wheels and tires. The wheels troubled me as part of each opening was hidden by a locater ring for the inner half of the wheel on the inside of the outside wheel piece. (Editor, please do something with that sentence lol) So, I was able to chuck them into my lathe and remove the ring hopefully making the brakes are more visible. With the wheel covers on the back wheels I didn’t have to worry about them. Speaking of the rear wheel covers, AMT only supplied 6 hole covers that I got from the Penske. I filled in three of the hole to represent the way the car looked for qualifying. Since then I’ve found a race day photo where the car was running 6 hole covers, so take your pick if you’re building this car.







Paul Erlendson

[Calvin]

Awesome! I didn't realize you had a little lathe. What kind is it?

I'm surprised I don't even have one as I have a degree in machining 🤓

[kyledehart5]

Well that’s a really nice improvement on the wheels. And the 3 hole wheel covers look great!

[pje]

Nov 6, 2023 13:19:37 GMT -5 Calvin said:

Awesome! I didn't realize you had a little lathe. What kind is it?

I'm surprised I don't even have one as I have a degree in machining 🤓

Here’s my little setup. This is a Sears craftsman branded Sherline unit I found in a used tool shop a number of years ago. With the help of a good friend, we refurbished it, mounted it on a base plate and set up a Dremel Tool drill press.





Paul Erlendson

[Calvin]

Nov 6, 2023 18:19:13 GMT -5 pje said:

Nov 6, 2023 13:19:37 GMT -5 Calvin said:

Awesome! I didn't realize you had a little lathe. What kind is it?

I'm surprised I don't even have one as I have a degree in machining 🤓

Here’s my little setup. This is a Sears craftsman branded Sherline unit I found in a used tool shop a number of years ago. With the help of a good friend, we refurbished it, mounted it on a base plate and set up a Dremel Tool drill press.

Paul Erlendson

I love it! I should've got one a long time ago, but unfortunately it doesn't make much sense for me to get one now with 3d printing taking over the modeling world by storm. ⚡️

[pje]

Well, crap!



I overstressed the seam with too much test fitting of the cockpit tub. I’ve removed some of the material on the side of the tub where the shifter linkage is located and also on the opposite side, and I’m adding material to the body where it meets the tub on the inside. I’m just trying to make things look more prototypical on the inside of the cockpit. It will help a ton with interior painting too. Since I have this added opening (the whole right side of the tub!) I’ll leave it open until I get the gaps closed the way I want. Then glue the right side back on (again) with a little added support.

Paul Erlendson

[indy]

Paul, I love the lathe setup. I sometimes wish I had the capability to lathe or mill pieces.

Sorry about the cockpit break. However, knowing you, it will be repaired better than before.

Jordan

[kyledehart5]

Sorry that happened Paul. No doubt Jordan is correct and you will repair it better than new.

[pje]

While I’m stumbling around trying to get the cockpit look more prototypical, I took a little break and turned my attention back again to the wheels. I had an old set of Cody Grayland turned valve stems that I wanted to use, so I figured out where they were positioned on the Lola wheels, drilled the hole and did a little test fitting. Only had to do the fronts, as Mario ran the car with the rear wheel covers all month. I’ve never found any info as why they never tried front wheel covers. Wheels are now ready for a little more cleanup, a good scrubbing and some primer.





Paul Erlendson

[Calvin]

Beautiful 😍

[pje]

Years ago, I turned a holder in my lathe for the tires and then trued them and cleaned off all the sidewall detail. Of course, now we have aftermarket resin tires that are all cleaned up and I never have to do this again for any of the old AMT kits.



I still believe that one of Mario’s big advantages for the 1987 500 was that he had more experience than any of the other drivers with radial tires. He had been a tester for Goodyear forever and he, along with his engineer, Adrian Newy had the setup on the Lola figured out from day 1.



Here’s where I could use some feedback. I’ve got both sets of Indycals Goodyear sidewall decals. I’ve used the originals with good success on painted resin tires, but never tried them on the vinyl AMT tires. I would like to try the new black wall decals, as I would have no worries of silvering, but I’m concerned that there will be some contrast with the tire itself. I do plan on sealing the sidewall with Future before decaling and then flat coating once the decals have dried. Either way, I’ll use Solvaset as Michael suggests. All thoughts and suggestions are welcome.



Paul Erlendson

[schix5150]

Tape the tread. Then use flat black rustoleum for rubber/vinyl from HD or auto parts store. Decal the tire with solvaset then clear with testors dull cote clear lacquer. Pull the tape off and lightly damp a rag with acetone to smooth and even out the tire tread.

Works for me,
Mike

[pje]

I think that I’m finally finished with the bodywork. When screwed the top and floor together I found that the bodywork had developed a small gap on the left side. I glued in some 010” Evergreen and it filled the gap perfectly. Time to give everything a good scrub and then a fresh coat of primer to see if it needs any additional work. ( I hope not) I’ve still got more detail work for the cockpit and instrument panel and a dozen other things, but if the base primer coat looks good I’m going to start building up the suspension.





Been a busy time for us and I haven’t been able to spend too much time at the bench, but I did finally get the bodywork cleaned up and we had a break in the weather so I got some primer shot. In inspecting my work between football games today I saw I had a couple areas that needed some additional work, so I did a little more sanding and puttying. My goal is to get this work finished up in the next couple of days.

Paul Erlendson

[indy]

Great stuff, Paul. Keep the updates coming.

Jordan

[kyledehart5]

Jan 29, 2024 1:24:09 GMT -5 pje said:

I think that I’m finally finished with the bodywork. When screwed the top and floor together I found that the bodywork had developed a small gap on the left side. I glued in some 010” Evergreen and it filled the gap perfectly. Time to give everything a good scrub and then a fresh coat of primer to see if it needs any additional work. ( I hope not) I’ve still got more detail work for the cockpit and instrument panel and a dozen other things, but if the base primer coat looks good I’m going to start building up the suspension.





Been a busy time for us and I haven’t been able to spend too much time at the bench, but I did finally get the bodywork cleaned up and we had a break in the weather so I got some primer shot. In inspecting my work between football games today I saw I had a couple areas that needed some additional work, so I did a little more sanding and puttying. My goal is to get this work finished up in the next couple of days.

Paul Erlendson

I love these kits but man the way you’re elevating this is superb, next level stuff. Just brilliant.

[shunter]

Great to see you get to this point….your work is looking great.
As for the tyre de Al’s, I have never had an issue with the standard white lettering only. Using Micro Sol & set and then the dull coat followed by a light touch of the Tamiya weathering to tone it down.

[jj66]

Great bodywork!

[pje]

Thanks for all the kind words and encouragement. It is much appreciated. I’m still finding areas of the bodywork that still needs some addition pinhole repair after sanding and priming and sanding and putty and primer, but I decided I need a little break from just bodywork.
If you look closely at the mocked up photos of the car, the bottom center of the floor is not sitting on the ground, but 1” off as it is sitting on a strip of plastic that is 1 scale inch thick. In looking at all the photos I have of the car at Indy I’m always struck at how low the car sits. I think that is part of Adrian Newy’s setup guidance. Seeing the rake of today’s Red Bull ground effects car, it would not surprise me if there was also a small rake in the settings of Mario’s car. That being said, I’ll just keep this one level.

To do that I have to take you back about 25 years. My good friend Dave Paar and I were frustrated with the difficulty we were having getting our open wheel builds to sit the way we wanted. Getting that forth corner to be flat on the ground could be a real pain! We did a lot of brain storming as we wanted something completely adjustable, so it could be used for a variety of models in various scales. This is what we came up with. Dave built two. One for himself and one for me and I am forever grateful.

The first step is to set up the wheelbase. Using the straight edge and triangle I can keep everything square. Then using the wheels and tires, the axle height is set. Once that was done I then set up the track position for the wheels/tires. Once everything is set, the axle mounting tubes can be moved out of the way and the car set in position on the 1” thick scale plank.



With everything now in position, I can now remove the wheels/tires and position the hub carriers on the mounts and start building up the suspension arms at the angles I want. That will give me the right ride height I want at final assembly.



Paul Erlendson

[Calvin]

Lol 😂 oh my GOSH! That's insane 😳
Your model factory is space age
What happens if you need to put negative camber in the car?

[indy]

Paul, I cannot tell you how many times I have tried to figure out a scale setup table. This is amazing, can you add toe-in/out and camber in positive/negative directions?

Jordan

[quattro]

Paul. This is all so next level.

My jaw dropped at the progress made on this model.

My jaw actually dropped out at the sight of that setup table.

Its not model building. Its NASA!

Superb.

[pntmachine]

That setup station is the coolest. The build is great piece of work itself but the setup blew me away. Nice piece of engineering work. Our station for RC racing pales in comparison to that. This build has been quite interesting.

[alterrenner]

Wow! That's some set-up table! Kind of expect to see a scale technician in a white lab' coat with a scale lap-top in it!
My set-up table is a large picture frame, with the photo replaced by graph paper over a thin steel plate, with magnets and washers for shims!
This is one incredible build!

--Frank

[pje]

Thanks for you kind comments and questions. No toe or camber adjustments on this jig. That would require a very complicated mount that we didn’t even consider when coming up with this design. Just adjustments for X, Y and Z axis. For me the important part was getting all four tires sitting squarely on the ground and in the case of some 1980’s ground effects cars with sliding or flexible skirts, like a Ligier JS-11, Ferrari 126C2, or Brabham BT50, I want the skirts resting level on the ground.

I didn’t like the look of the molded in external starter receptacle on the back of the Lola transaxle, so while the primer was drying I made a new one. I like separate little assemblies like this as they’re much easier paint and give better definition.






Paul Erlendson

[pje]

I know that this doesn’t look like much, but I’ve had quite a think about the suspension, especially the rear. I believe (hope) it’s actually coming together. Today the 1.5mm stainless rod arrived. I think I’m going to be able to create some rather prototypical half shafts with these. Fingers crossed.



Paul Erlendson