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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2012 16:05:25 GMT -5
I think this bunch of Indy knowledgable guys might be able to help with this question........what was STP red? Was it always dayglo? , or did it start out as a bright red and become fluorescent when the paint technology advanced enough to make it glossy.
The earliest dayglo paints were dead flat and if you glossed them they just became straight red.
The '63 Novi is on the bench and I'm inclined go with bright red.
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Post by Calvin on Jan 10, 2012 16:22:00 GMT -5
Dont go with bright red because its dayglo. For some reason cameras back then couldn't.......um....... (help me Michael ;D )......handle the brightness of dayglo red so it always looks just bright red. Lance used Tamiya flo red - takes a number of light coats to get it close to STP dayglo. IMO you will need more than 6 light coats of Tamiya flo red to get it accurate. If you dont do more than 3 coats IMO its too orange. Make sure you get a new can of Tamiya flo red as well. If you have never use tamiya sprays before I very highly recommend reading this (its my bible) www.tamiyausa.com/articles/feature.php?article-id=35 |
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Post by Chris on Jan 10, 2012 17:05:10 GMT -5
When I built the Lotus 56B Offy I found the easiest way to replicate STP Red was to use a base coat of Tamiya Bright Red Ts8 I think itis and the 3 or 4 coats of Flor-Red Ts36? ....   The red base will eliminate the orange hue from the Flor... |
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Post by indycals on Jan 10, 2012 17:20:04 GMT -5
Some of the STP cars were not dayglo red - but Herks' 63 definitely was. The best way to tell is from photos shot in black and white - a red car appears dark, a dayglo red car appears VERY light grey. The key is that the shot must have been taken in black and white. I've seen black and white shots that were taken in color and converted to B&W for publishing in a newspaper or book and it doesn't work. A great example of this is the shot of Jim Clark's 1966 Lotus in They Call Me Mr. 500 - that image was shot in color and converted to black and white.
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Post by indycals on Jan 10, 2012 17:23:02 GMT -5
Here's a perfect example. We know that the outside stripe on Parnelli's car is regular red. Look how much darker it is than Herk's car:  |
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Post by lance on Jan 10, 2012 19:25:45 GMT -5
63 dayglo, 64-65 Ferguson Novi's red, 65 Hutubise Novi dayglo, 66-73 dayglo.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2012 19:42:34 GMT -5
That's a very definitive rsponse. Thanks Lance!
The fluoro red over bright red looks very good.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 11, 2012 10:49:40 GMT -5
Just a footnote on the "Fergie" 4-w Novi. It was the only product to ever come out of "Garage 97" in the late 80's. Crude but cute. I went to Vince G. when he was fielding Roberto before his practice crash. He said after the body work was redone after the garage fire and it came time to shoot the car they used a off the shelf Auto Body RED, nothing special. We tried three or four test squares and settled on 165-L Rubine Red from 1Shot sign lettering enamel. Back-in-the-day you could get it @ Central Decorators, now 24 years later I don't know who handles it.
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Post by mrindy77 on Jan 11, 2012 12:20:04 GMT -5
Just a footnote on the "Fergie" 4-w Novi. It was the only product to ever come out of "Garage 97" in the late 80's. Crude but cute. I went to Vince G. when he was fielding Roberto before his practice crash. He said after the body work was redone after the garage fire and it came time to shoot the car they used a off the shelf Auto Body RED, nothing special. We tried three or four test squares and settled on 165-L Rubine Red from 1Shot sign lettering enamel. Back-in-the-day you could get it @ Central Decorators, now 24 years later I don't know who handles it. Zoomer Garage 97 also did a 1957/58 Sam Hanks /Jimmy Bryan winner. Cal |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 11, 2012 17:13:25 GMT -5
Thanks Cal , I stand corrected. Rick had a mold of the epperly buck when I resigned.
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Post by indycals on Jan 17, 2012 4:29:53 GMT -5
Here's another great example of how dayglo red photographs. First image was shot in color (which could only display it as standard red) and converted to black and white. Second shot was shot in black and white, which captures the vibrance of dayglo colors. Both the Lotus logo and STP logo are standard red. This image tells me that the STP cars were VERY dayglo.   |
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Post by kurzheck on Jan 17, 2012 7:56:23 GMT -5
Great comparison shot.
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Post by gavkiwi on Jan 17, 2012 9:15:27 GMT -5
Indeed, the difference is quite remarkable. Is there any difference color wise between M@r1b0r0 fluro 'red' and STP 'red'. The reason I ask this, is to my eyes, they are almost identicle. I cannot tell a difference at all. Wouldn't tamiya fluro red sprayed on top of tamiya white primer be an ideal way to duplicate the color on a model car?  |
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Post by Chris on Jan 17, 2012 12:17:32 GMT -5
M@r1b0r0 Red is a Flor Red and the STP Red is more of a Glowing Red, Tamiya Flor Red over white primer will get you a super Flor red that has to be toned down for STP Rd   I hope these pics show the difference... Chris  |
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Post by gavkiwi on Jan 17, 2012 12:24:13 GMT -5
Chris, I appreciate the comparison shots, But I have seen recent pics of Mario's '69 winner on display at IMS, both indoors and outside on the start/finish straight, and the colors look the same to me, maybe I am partially color blind lol  To me the shot of Bruno Senna driving his Uncle's M@r1b0r0 McLaren at Goodwood in 2009 I think and the shot of Mario's '69 winner taken recently, the colors are the same to me the great debate rages on  I know one thing, when I get around to painting piquets '93 STP Lola, it will be tamiya white primer with tamiya fluro red, which If I am not mistaken, is the colors Michael at Indycals used for the one on his website, again I may be wrong, and I am only assuming, but I think I am right |
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Post by indycals on Jan 17, 2012 13:35:00 GMT -5
I think M@r1b0r0 red and STP red are virtually the same. I will politely beg to differ with Chris and say that TS36 doesn't need to be toned down for STP red - unless you are trying to match color photos.
Unfortunately color photos are NOT reliable to show dayglo red (especially older photos) - this is where black and white film actually has the advantage. Processing, scanning and color calibration (or potential lack thereof) also remove reliability. The artemis image was shot on slide film and then scanned in after sitting nearly 40 years in a barn (I actually scanned that image myself - I spent my first year in Colorado working for Artemis).
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Post by indycals on Jan 17, 2012 13:37:34 GMT -5
From personal experience, the dayglo STP red used on the 81-82 Wildcats (and Richard Petty's cars in the 80s) IS a virtual spot on match to M@r1b0r0 red.
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Post by Calvin on Jan 17, 2012 15:35:30 GMT -5
This is a great thread BTW! I was never 100% sure about STP dayglo.
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Post by Chris on Jan 17, 2012 16:20:57 GMT -5
Michael, I think you are right about those years and cars but I think the earlier STP cars were slightly different. Like you say, Judging off photos is difficult to tell. I think if the cars were lined up side by side there would be obvious differences, but that is not likely to happen and we all see colors slightly different.. At least I think thats why I keep getting in trouble with the wife when it comes to Home decor!!!! or So She Says!!! Chris |
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Post by gavkiwi on Jan 17, 2012 16:31:38 GMT -5
Michael, I think you are right about those years and cars but I think the earlier STP cars were slightly different. Like you say, Judging off photos is difficult to tell. I think if the cars were lined up side by side there would be obvious differences, but that is not likely to happen and we all see colors slightly different.. At least I think thats why I keep getting in trouble with the wife when it comes to Home decor!!!! or So She Says!!! Chris No Chris, thats because picking out colors, and then subsequently painting the walls of the house with said new colors from home depot, is a womens job Since she picked the colors in the first place lol. |
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Post by mjjracer on Jan 17, 2012 19:21:13 GMT -5
Michael, I think you are right about those years and cars but I think the earlier STP cars were slightly different. Like you say, Judging off photos is difficult to tell. I think if the cars were lined up side by side there would be obvious differences, but that is not likely to happen and we all see colors slightly different.. At least I think thats why I keep getting in trouble with the wife when it comes to Home decor!!!! or So She Says!!! Chris No Chris, thats because picking out colors, and then subsequently painting the walls of the house with said new colors from home depot, is a womens job Since she picked the colors in the first place lol. You haven't been married, have you? ;D |
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Post by gavkiwi on Jan 17, 2012 20:15:25 GMT -5
No Chris, thats because picking out colors, and then subsequently painting the walls of the house with said new colors from home depot, is a womens job Since she picked the colors in the first place lol. You haven't been married, have you? ;D Once, big mistake |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2012 23:56:37 GMT -5
;D ;D Hello all,I am new in this forum,and since my recent registration I have a delicious meal with all your features.Very great thanks to all. And if i am a modest car modeler,I like very well these Indy cars. And with my modest contribution,I've collected these DayGlo STP car pictures from 1963 to 1968:  1963 Indy 500--Jim Hurtubise #56 STP Hotel Tropicana Kurtis-Novi (as I remember,a friend made this one with the great Lance Seller model,and for the paint he used a white base with three coats of Tamiya Fluo red)...  1964 Indy 500 Bobby Unser #9 Studebaker-Stp Speciel Ferguson Novi (here,please help me,dayglo red or Novi red??)  1965 Indy 500 race Jim Hurtubise #59 Tomstone Life Kurtis-Novi (as I remember in the practice of this race the same car was blue & yellow,and for the race in this dayglo color...And to this one the same painting of the '63 STP Tropicana Kurtis-Novi or not??)  1966 Indy 500 Al Unser #18 STP Oil Treatment Spl. Lotus Ford (Tamiya Fluo red on red base or dayglo on white base??)  1966 Indy 500 Jim Clark #19 STP Oil Treatment Spl. Lotus Ford  1966 Indy 500 Jim Clark with his boss(or father!!) Colin Chapman  If I remember I've made this car many years ago(thirty years)with the excellent IMC 66 STP Lotus,and at this time I had painted my model with flat white in base and the old dayglo red from Pactra to a good result(at this time!!!).  1967 Indy 500 Parnelli Jones #40 STP Oil Treatment Spl. Granatelli Pratt & Whitney With all team crews and Mr. "STP" Andy Granatelli. (I have this model in resin cast in 1/25 and also the old MPC in 1/20,but anyone can help me to the real color???).  1968 Indy 500 race Joe Leonard #60 STP Oil Treatment Spl. Lotus Pratt & Whitney One of the three which raced this year,with two fluo colors,red & yellow... (I have also this one in 7 model kits from MPC 1/25,to made all versions -68 Indy Turbine,69 Indy Offy or Plymouth versions,and also the F1 Gold Leaf or the Fittipaldi black & gold versions)... OF,I think you have many answers to me on these colors,and I hope this reply was not too long!!! Best greetings to all,and a good morning from the GUADELOUPE,in French west indies(Caribbean sea). gwadagone www.gwadagone.fotki.com/ |
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Post by indycals on Jan 18, 2012 0:03:01 GMT -5
Glad to have you hear gwadagone.
The Bobby Unser Novi was NOT dayglo red - it was red, with a slight orange hue to it. Not sure about the Tombstone life car. All the other cars are dayglo red. I'd go TS36 on all of them.
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Post by indycals on Jan 18, 2012 0:05:52 GMT -5
Upon further review... dayglo red on the Tombstone car - with a dayglo red STP logo on the nose (but not on the oil tank)  |
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Post by Chris on Jan 18, 2012 0:08:20 GMT -5
Hi gwadagone, we have been friends on fotki for quite a while and you have some really great pics in your albums, Thanks for you input on this subject.. this thread is as varied as the actual color of the AAR Eagle Blue!!! Chris (pmodwrks) |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2012 1:17:33 GMT -5
Dear Gwadagone,
The only "red" car the show the 64 STP Special Ferguson Novi that Uncle Bobby wreck on lap two. That was Blood Red. All other cars that you show, including the 67 Paxton Turbine that Parnelli Jones drove where STP "Green"......Day-Glow Red.
Hope this helps.
Russ
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Post by Calvin on Jan 18, 2012 4:06:09 GMT -5
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Post by 11rowsof3 on Jan 18, 2012 6:52:42 GMT -5
Dear Gwadagone, The only "red" car the show the 64 STP Special Ferguson Novi that Uncle Bobby wreck on lap two. That was Blood Red. All other cars that you show, including the 67 Paxton Turbine that Parnelli Jones drove where STP "Green"......Day-Glow Red. Hope this helps. Russ I think this is true 100%. I have a friend that goes to the races with us who was in high school in 1967 and confirms without a doubt every May that the Paxton was so Florescent you could see it on the moon. Ditto on the Tropicana Herk car as we built the slot car and I actually stopped in the Photo Shop at the museum and asked Donald... he confirmed it was Day-Glo. I think the only one that was not was Bobby's... |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2016 17:58:23 GMT -5
Here's another great example of how dayglo red photographs. First image was shot in color (which could only display it as standard red) and converted to black and white. Second shot was shot in black and white, which captures the vibrance of dayglo colors. Both the Lotus logo and STP logo are standard red. This image tells me that the STP cars were VERY dayglo. |
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